Who else thinks this is BULLSH1T??? Speak up so it may be changed !!!!!

I am sorry for being this upset but if enough of the members that have been here for a while agree then Maybe I was Not the only one pissed. We had a huge problem with Face Offs being too buddy buddy oriented then the JFO came along and everyone was happy. Then you could bet on a winner. Most of us that have seen how this works benefited greatly from this and got used to it and now I feel the system has failed and needs revamped. There seems to be a new buddy system in either the judges or some judges that really dont have a clue how to judge a face off the way us GOTSTANG Members do.

J could you please fix this problem. When I am wrong with a bet I take it in stride but not choosing someone JUST because she has pissed you off or you dont like her is an all new low.

I think this face off #748 should stand WITH Nay losing just because she picked on someone with a way lesser web site but I think all wagers and win streaks should be given back to the members. Anyone else feel the same way? If I am out voted on this one please delete my Got Stang site!!!!

These are the judges oppinions.

After reviewing both sites, I have to say that BOTH need to add Pic's to their websites for F/O Challenges. Nay has all the required pic's for each area if this was a Best OverAll F/O, there is just not enough of them to get a really good look at anything. 1Krazypony needs to add pic's for the engine bay, trunk, interior and undercarriage. Since this f/o is goin for the stock challenge instead of a Best Overall, I would have to say that exterior wise, 1krazypony takes it. This F/O has left it up to the judges for their interpetation on how this F/O is viewed and decided and this is mine. Picked
1Krazypony


Since nay put up the challenge I am gonna judge pics for pics based on Krazy's site. Both car's are very clean and up to par. I am gonna have to lean towards the Krazy man based on the color and appearance of his ride. Picked
1Krazypony

1krazy doesnt have anything in the way of pics outside of exterior to judge. nay first time i've seen this ride, very nice ,and great detailing, looks close to new Picked
Nay

AND NOW THE COMMENTS FROM SOME MEMBERS WHO'S OPPINIONS SHOULD MATTER !!!!!!!!!!!

I thought this was a overall challenge and by looking at the wagers. I think alot of other people did as well.. ohh wellll time to build up the wager points again.
People gotta use basic language in a face-off I think. "Best Interior", "Best Paintjob" or "Best Overall" It might confuse betters and judges otherwise.
i AGREE WITH HIM BUT IT WASNT THAT HARD TO FIGURE OUT WHAT SHE WAS TALKING ABOUT.

I think this face off was bull shit. I am sick and tired of loosing my damned win streaks and points on face offs that in no damned way should have been judged the way they were. 1krazy doesnt have anything in the way of pics outside of exterior to judge. Then how the hell did he win???? Since nay put up the challenge I am gonna judge pics for pics based on Krazy's site. Why not base pics on both websites. A STOCK 5.0 Challenge means to me the same as BEST OVERALL and by looking at the bets 390 to 4355 I am not the only one that has thought this way. Nay has all the required pic's for each area if this was a Best OverAll F/O, there is just not enough of them to get a really good look at anything. ALL REQUIRED PICS.....ENOUGH SAID!!!!!!!!! 1Krazypony needs to add pic's for the engine bay, trunk, interior and undercarriage. Come on judges if you have beef with her cause the way she chooses easier opponents thats one thing and I honestly can say I have to agree sometimes but damn it you absolutely cannot take it out on the people betting on these face offs. If you could not tell that Stock 5.0 Challenge meant Best overall you have no damned reason being a judge. I AM NOT THE ONLY ONE THAT THINKS THIS WAY JUST SEEM TO BE THE ONLY ONE WITH ENOUGH BALLS TO ADMIT IT.

That is the reason why I quit voting on them and made it, so people can't challenge me in F/O's either. To much if the buddy system or people just don't know what they are doin'!

Judges are using the buddy system and that takes the fun out of everything. This isn't going to work every well if these bs keeps up.. the judges need to look at whats what and not oh i like his color better then his.. like wtf a color or a color if you don't like it oh well..

I have to agree that some of them are NOT judged the way they should be. I see judges chose cars because they like the color better,or the body style better,or whatever. It should be based on cleanliness,mods,and how much work is put into a car,and how it's shown on their site. Not personal preference on a color ,ect.

i agree completely. thats the reason i quit voting....tired of the B/S. sorry but thats what it is. its been going downhill for some time now and its only getting worse. i guess when you hit rock bottom you can dig alittle deeper and get alittle bit lower. this just goes to prove that.

I was kinda wondering the same thing???????? WTF

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 91gt331

I have to agree that some of them are NOT judged the way they should be. I see judges chose cars because they like the color better,or the body style better,or whatever. It should be based on cleanliness,mods,and how much work is put into a car,and how it's shown on their site. Not personal preference on a color ,ect.

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+1

i agree...even people with websites that dont have many pics on there lose points and shit from other challenging them when they have no chance at all winning. Those should get cancelled or not even happen at all.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 91gt331

I have to agree that some of them are NOT judged the way they should be. I see judges chose cars because they like the color better,or the body style better,or whatever. It should be based on cleanliness,mods,and how much work is put into a car,and how it's shown on their site. Not personal preference on a color ,ect.

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+ 2 and then some

i agree...even people with websites that dont have many pics on there lose points and shit from other challenging them when they have no chance at all winning. Those should get cancelled or not even happen at all.

Yes that is true and I feel for them but why are they asking to get classified if they dont have enough pics and why take it out on the members that consistently bet on JFO's. I dont just bet on ones I know are easy wins. I rarely dont vote on a JFO. Thats all I am trying to say. This faceoff was given to someone just because the judges didnt like another person and it is at the price of the members betting. Thats what I feel is bull shit.

good point...screw them all and their JFO's

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Juiced2002GT

i agree...even people with websites that dont have many pics on there lose points and shit from other challenging them when they have no chance at all winning. Those should get cancelled or not even happen at all.

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If you don't challenge you don't lose any points Juice. Only the person that actually made the challenge is risking points.

Okay, I am going to dig into this with my opinion....

Classification: This area needs work and judging from the rash of changes I have seen the last week or so things might be. I have noticed that the list of people waiting to be classified is down to nothing and that some cars have changed classifications while others classified no longer are.

JFO: JFO's are still opinion. The opinion of three people rather than a group vote which is what people wanted. Recently some of the comments have gotten out of hand by the judges... flipping a coin and so forth and even Nay's recent face-off that she probably should have won based on images available. There are also some people that have taken on questionable face-off and created people that will look for any reason to vote against them.

some judges appear more into engine work, others the more visual. I have also seen some of the judges comments get better and more detailed. Hell, they are even voting faster than before. With every judge having the same avatar now it's hard to determine which judge or even two judges that might be the problem.

but I am sick of the buddy system comments about everything. It happens with anything and everything that involves human beings interacting with each other. It's a competition thing. There are three judges voting in these face-off, so the "buddy system" is minimal. It's all about opinions and the judges need to keep personal feeling out of the equation or some folks would never win even if they were facing off against themselves. No system is perfect and everyone here, including myself, has had a streak broken based on the judges decisions, which we know had to be wrong. This is suppose to be for fun just like the tournaments and car shows. Hell, no one likes to lose and we always think our car or opinion is better than the next guy in most cases. If you don't want to get into the fun stuff like face-offs, hunts, tournaments or car shows then take down all your car pictures and just cruise around and have a good time looking and reading everyone elses comments. That way there is nothing that can piss you off or get you upset because you are just lerkering around watching everyone else mingle and have a good time.

The comments everyone has made are valid. There are one or two judges not taking it serious enough or just using their vote to go against everyone else. But I don't think it's fair to toss all eight judges into the fire when I have read some really good comments recently. Some of these judges are doing the job and putting in the effort.

Okay... that's my two cents. Throw your rocks now... I got my bling bus helmet and jock strap on. Bruise me, but don't abuse me. :)

:censored: I can't fine a rock throwing smile. J can you please add one. :thanks:


P.S.
J can you also add a Short Bus smiley and a helment smiley.

Crimson I totally agree with you and your above statement. If you read mine I in no way said or meant all judges. I gaurantee you that if and when the ones that pissed away that face off read my post they immediately knew I was talking dirrectley to them. I in no way shape or form want all the judges to think I am bashing on them. I have noticed a few judges that do everything they can do to help us do better and comment great. Can you honestly tell me that this face off was fair and that if you lost a streak and points that you wouldnt be upset???? I honestly think not. I dont so much care about that now but would like to see that this shit stops. I bet on these as if I am judging the JFO myself. If I am going to take my time to research each one and each others site it is just repulsive to me that someone that is supposed to is not doing it the way they were trusted to do. Thats all I am saying. I even told the other guy that I was not trying to bash on him and gave him some insight on how and what would make his site better. Just hate to see things like this happen. This is like the third or so long streak that I have lost cause of something that was debatable. Sorry if I offended anyone that didnt deserve it.

Ok, I'm going to sound like I'm from Switerland but this is my opinion. I agree with you on some points but then I also disagree with you on some. I lost 1000 pts on that FO and the same time won 1000 (thanks ylwfevr for winning) so my streak went to 0 again. If I may make a suggestion: J can you make only choices for the JFOs instead of the default and type what you want. For example 1) Best Overall 2) Best Exterior 3) Best Interior 4) Best Engine 5) Best Sound System 6) Best Undercarriage. This way it keeps it simple and no one has to try and decipher what the FO is about.

In nay's JFO she was the one who put Stock challenge which opens the door to interpretation. I was thinking along the lines of best overall but my other half took it as which was the better stock looking Mustang. krzypony didn't have all the pics for an overall, and you could take it as nay was making a confusing title so it wouldn't look like she was taking on the lesser car for an easy win, or since her opponent only had exterior pics it was a fancy way of saying best exterior. Personally I would like to hear what nay meant by the title and then we could get a better idea on how it should have went.

The judges have it hard, and they are entitled to their opinion of which one is better than the other that's the way it goes. I have lost JFOs (at least one) because of color or body style. In their defense, if I was one and had to read something negative every week about the judging I would stop doing it. In another case I see one of the judges got fed up and wote the comments in spanish, which really wasn't fair to the competitors.

I agree. I stayed away from that JFO simply because Nay was involved in it. You just don't know what could happen regardless of how the sites appeared. Krazy should not have even been classified as Yo mentioned I believe. He never should have won simply because he didn't have anything except exterior shots... my opinion again. Best overall means interior, exterior and engine. The undercarriage, trunk and so one is pudding on the pie so to speak. But some of the judges don't think as I do.

As YS has commented... it would be best if only direct titles could be used... Best this or that and no two could be selected together. At least it cuts down on Interpretation as some people have picked three different titles for one face-off. :silly:

Damn it fellows I hate to admit it but I agree. But for gods sake can either of you honestly tell me that if ME VS YOU, were going head to head and i Said Stock 5.0 challenge that the judges would not go all out and vote best over all, then either I need my head examined or that face off is total bull shit. I think JFO's should have the exact categories that ya'll mentioned so Nay and some other bitch ass point hoggers could not get away with cheatin,(in my own personal oppinion)which it what it is...... She is not the only one and till we.........MEMBERS put an end to it,it will never end. VP does it just as much if not more than she does and no one is bitchin. Lets fix the god damned problem and be done with it. I will absolutely not be happy until J resets my winning streak and gives me back my well earned points. If not then to hell with got stang and everything it represents. I am so tired of all the damned politics and being buddies with this guy and being in with this team that I could give just about two shits at this point.

Oh believe me the judges and members have bitched about VP's questionable selection and catagories. If you check his past JFO's there are comments to this stuff. I am leary of betting on his face-offs as well. There is no delete option for the judges where it could be deleted if say two of the three selected the option (which would be cool, if it could even be done). The other side of the coin is that the judges really need to be fair even on a bad face-off because it affects the members that are voting on them and their points.

As I said, no system is perfect but the buddy system is still minimal with the JFO and hopefully the judges are honorable enough to put aside any team crap when it comes to judging a face-off.

And most of all remember that this is an online car show. How you present your car determines if you win. YOu could have the best ride on the site, but if your pictures are hard to find, there aren't enough of them, no outside pretty shots, or poor quality you may not win against a lesser car that has presented their ride to a better degree. There have been tons of judges comments regarding photo quality, the images available and missing stuff that it should alert members that most judges are looking deep into the sites and really checking out the cars. I said most... not all, as is evident by many recent comments and "lack" of judgement in some JFOs.

If more people get involved like Yo has with his comments and even more actually make the effort to participate on the site it can get better and better every day. But everyone here has to put forth an effort to change things and be a part of it. J is just one person running GS and there are so many areas that people want changes to, upgrades to, more of this and that. Just getting pissed off and refusing to participate, or leaving the site is childish and stupid.

I have met some really cool people here over the last year. Just some of a few of them are HerNastyNotch, Ysoffcr, Yellowshaker04, ylwfevr, 91GT331, Tweety, Blissfullerin, J, Nicole3x3, Wldponi03, Yosemiddysam, and so many others that I have spoken with a few times or done sigs/graphics for. I have gotten mad, pissed off, and whatever else you can think of but I have never left or even thought about it. Belly up to the bar people. Participate rather than run away or refuse to play. Sure makes for a boring time. Opinions are like assholes - everyone has them... and they stink. But we all want to hear them, debate them, talk about them and just maybe bitch about them too. LOL.

well said!!!!

Very well said, Tim. I've been pissed off at a few things on this site, but never thought to leave it. I've also met some great people on this site and really hate to see people leave for whatever the reason. Like Tim said J is only one person and he can't do it all himself, that's the reason I offered to help with the trivia since it had been months since a new one was up.

Just to add a point about what Crimson said about it being an online carshow, I just recently met a member who I had lost a JFO to in the past. We were standing outside and I popped the hood to show it off a little and he said, "Your's is clean, no wonder you were upset when you lost." It just goes to show you can't get the overall feel of someone's Stang on the net that you do in person.

True but the point of this whole damned thing was there is ABSOLUTELY NO WAY THIS FACE OFF SHOULD HAVE BEEN JUDGED THIS WAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
For some reaon it has gotten away from this. I could give two shits who won or lost but it should have been judged different. Thats all I was pissed about. Kinda strikes me wierd that this thread has been going on for a few days now and J has not commented once.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by crimsonblack

The comments everyone has made are valid. There are one or two judges not taking it serious enough or just using their vote to go against everyone else. But I don't think it's fair to toss all eight judges into the fire when I have read some really good comments recently. Some of these judges are doing the job and putting in the effort.

Okay... that's my two cents. Throw your rocks now... I got my bling bus helmet and jock strap on. Bruise me, but don't abuse me. :)

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:nya:

Couldn't resist that invitation! Seriously though, I thought the JFO between me and YsOffcr was good... the judges that did ours took the time to look at our sites, didn't get personal and gave constructive feedback.

OK GS members, judges have enough problems judging as it is, but what do you want us to do when members like Nay go against another member,just to try an easy win! It's not fair to the other member and it's an insult to us judges that try to judge these kind of JFO's. Maybe J can pentalize the person going for the easy wins, this kind of stuff needs to stop. There is to much arguing going on. Just remember ,that GS is a good site ,but if members go after other members just to get easy points, then we'll be loosing in the long run, because people will go to another site. Plus weather some of you realize it or not, potential sponsors visit this site, to find cars that they would like to sponsor. A company wants a person with a good attitude, because if they do sponsor you, you represent them and their products.
I don't know about other members,but when my sponsors visit GS, I want them to see a good community and a great site. Gotstang is a great place to be, but if stuff like this don't get taken care of, then GS will slowly be destroyed.
As far as judgeing a JFO I look at every aspect of each car over and over, page by page, before I make a decision. :gso:

Sure, some JFO's are not fair. Even if Nay or anyone else gets into a face-off that's an easy win the judges MUST be honest and give the person that deserves it the win. If you vote against the person because they went after an easy victory the judges cheat the system and screw over the members that are wagering on the events outcome. That judge or those judges would be the ones screwing with the integrity of the system that's been put into place and make the judges look bad.

If you see a bullshit face-off then email J and he can remove it. He did it with the JFO between SatinLow and OneBad95 for Best Overall Car by cancelling it.

This is not some sanctioned website by some registered car event. Sponsors coming to check out GotStang doesn't mean anything. If they are looking for cars to sponsor they've come to right site. There are some excellent Mustangs here. Our online events, JFO's, hunts and so one should mean nothing to them. These are just ways for the sites members to interact.

Judges have the responsiblity to be honest and straight forward when they do a face-off whether they like the person or not. It's about the mustangs and how they are presented, photographed and maintained. Judges don't control who faces off against who, that's what the ultimate FO is for. If J doesn't pull it for an obvious reason the judges need to go in, judge the face-off honestly and write-up their comments professionally and present their votes to the masses. That's it. And... they need to do it in a timely manner as well.

Voting against the better car because they believe the face-off is unfair is unfair to the rest of GS and it's members.

Well said crimson.. That was my whole point.

Your right to an extent! But, it doesn't give the newest GS members a look at how good this site is. It's giving GS a bad rep! myself ,I don't judge a JFO and give it to the car ,just cause the member goes for an easy win! I've been temped to ,but I haven't yet! I don't want to mess up the members who are wagering points. Maybe J, can add a disqualifing option. I don't mind judgeing the JFO's ,but to really judge a JFO takes time to do it right, and it's not fair to us judges to go for these easy wins! We take the time to judge them ,so come on GS'ers do the right thing and go against an opponient that is in the same ball park as you! To judge a JFO right ,you have to go back and forth on each site ,page by page and compare. sometimes you have to go to one site ,then right straight to a nother to determine your pick.

Of course going for an easy win doesn't mean they will get it. The other person may not have checked the entire site or simply made a mistake thinking they were better than the other car. But when a car with zero interior and engine shots beats a car that has the exterior, the engine and the interior pix is wrong. I don't care how great the other car is. If the great car on here had no interior or engine shots they should not be able to take a victory for best overall car - and that is what started this forum gripe. No judge could honestly vote for the car with missing shots against a lesser car that had all the shots. Undercarriage and trunk photos are nice to have but the interior and engine are a must for best overall.

Hey crimson did ya see the latest JFO. I hope I dont get picked on fer going for a lesser opponent. Just thought it was time fer her to learn her lesson.

Yeah, I saw it. I thought it was a fair match up Yo. Not picking on her at all.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by yosemiddysam

Hey crimson did ya see the latest JFO. I hope I dont get picked on fer going for a lesser opponent. Just thought it was time fer her to learn her lesson.

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Lol Is that what you were trying to do? I told you before, I'm open for any JFO. It doesn't bother me if I lose. :) Especially if it's against someone in my category. If you had a problem with losing on the occasion, you wouldn't take the chance and sign up to be classified in the first place!

The way I see it is if you had enough pictures and information to be classified, you have enough pictures and information to be judged in a Face Off. Therefore, if they only have 5 pictures of their car and a judge has obviously seen it fit to classify them, why is it against the "social rules" to challenge against them?

To many people are classified and have their face-offs turned off.

Then why haven't they been removed from the classified lists?

Probably because J hasn't set that as a rule to be classified. The whole reason to get classified is to compete in team events (should they eventually happen) and for JFO's.

Well, I understand that. But, why should it be wrong to go against ANY classified member, when they signed up to be classified for JFOs/Team Events in the first place?

Because certain judges see you constantly going after people with one page. There are way more people in your classes that have a full website that you could go up against and make it a good face off. Instead they see you constantly betting 500 points on a sure win with someone with one page and damned sure not enough pics for a BEST OVER ALL and then they just vote against you and honest people like me and quite a few others in here lose points and win streaks and it seem like you could give two shits about it. When I commented one your face off you was like "eh it happens" which made me even madder cause it added insult to injury. Nay I personally think you have some nice ass Stangs but you make them look bad by YOUR way of challenging people. I can not fully hold you responsible because its not your fault that these people got classified and in a sense you are right to challenge them. Just think of it this way how many people can you honestly say ALWAYS go for a much weaker opponent. I can think of about 3 and I have spoken to them as well. Hell over 3/4's of your face offs I would delete if I had the power just because the other persons site dont have the required pics. I have absolutely no hard feelings for you. I just would like to see you step it up and challenge members that have a site sutible for a JFO. If ya wanna go best over all then make sure they have the pics. If not try best engine or best exterior/interior, whatever they have pictures of. Sorry if this pisses you off but as you put it "eh it happens"

The only thing required to get classified is one picture of the exterior, interior, engine and a mod list. if someone asks to get classified with the minimal images then they probably deserve to get picked on. There are really only so many cars of equal... says looks or mods that someone can compete against. Most peoples sites are light in one area or another... mostly it's lots of exterior pictures and maybe a shot or two of the engine and interior.

Then they get classified and turn their disable the face-offs which is the only reason to get classified right now. You should have to be classified to compete in anything... car show, tournaments, face-offs, whatever.

And to get classified you should have all the required pics and not just one or two of anything.

Wow, after reading through all the comments i have to say that i agree with Crimsonblack. We need to have specified categories that people can use to determine what the face-offs are going to be judged on or if we arent goin to have them, then we need to give the judges some way to get rid of an easy-win faceoff. I can certainly appreciate the judges point of view as they pretty much have had their hands tied in these situations. Either they vote for the car that ligitimately wins the faceoff or they vote against the car that is trying to get the easy win. Whats the right call?? I am of the opinion that the judges do need an out for these BS faceoffs, and i want to say that i think 1HOTPONY was cool to come on and give us some insight.

I also wanted to add that Nay has a point with the "why are they classified if they dont want to be in a JFO?" If they are classified to a degree i guess she's got a point, now whether or not one goes after those people thats a different story. I guess it just comes down to the social rules that she mentioned earlier.

My final thought is this, and i know we have all heard it on various mustang sites when we are refering to mods "Not my cup of tea, but if you like it then cool." Guess we'll just have to see what happens with who people decide to faceoff against.

Ok I'm off the soapbox...... who's got next?

I am just glad the Moderately Modified class is full of people that know how to build a decent site. Other wise the judges would go nuts trying to decifer the mods lists lol.